Scientology - Through the Door

Interviews

Thursday, 17th September, 2009 10:13:37am

Name or Alias: Maria
Training and/or processing level: OT4 / Class 5
Org or location: Canada/US
Time involved in the Church of Scientology: 33 years
Recommended Website - N/A
1. How did you first become acquainted with the Church of Scientology?
I was invited to do a personality test on the street, later invited to a lecture by a person I worked with.

2. What initially appealed to you about scientology?
I had just completed a five year exhaustive study of eastern religions and spirtuality. I found a very truthful explanation of spirit in the works of Paramahansa Yogananda, essentially that you are a spirit, and you have a body, instead of you are a body that has a spirit and your spirit goes to heaven/hell/nirvana/somewhere when you die. In the first lecture I attended, that was how spirit or thetan was defined. I was very pleased to find that definition, alive and well and being used as the primary assumption of a spiritual route. Nice.

I loved the concept of 'What is true for you is what you have observed for yourself.'

I was aware that the potentialities of the spirit were vast, perhaps even incomprehensible to earth-bound existence. That is what Ron was saying and I agreed. Having had a lot of auditing now, I agree even more. Contrary to popular belief, its not about knocking hats off or being a magician. It has nothing to do with the physical universe at all really. Any improvement in the physical universe is a nice (or not nice) side effect, not the main show.

I liked that I could do the auditing and training and experience spiritual awareness and freedom WHILE I WAS STILL ALIVE instead of having to wait until it was too late, and I was dead. Death is pretty final and there is no going back if a religion's teachings turn out to be completely wrong. I liked that Scientology offered a route that didn't require death to see if it was right. I can do all the Scientology auditing, and if it doesn't work, fine, I can continue my quest. The important thing to me was that I could continue because I was still alive to continue.


3. Were there problems in your life that you thought scientology would address?
No. I was on the track of spiritual enlightenment and I was not interested in Scientology as a 'cure' or method of handling other people or making more money or being successful at work or having a good marriage. I really didn't give a damn about all that, I thought that was up to me to make a good life for myself. Scientology has some really tools I can use to do that, right now, not in some hereafter.

4. Did you see, experience, or hear about things that didn't seem right while you were in the Church of Scientology? What were they, and what convinced you to set aside your feelings?
What has continually astonished me in my years of Scientology is how few people actually understand what it is and what it is intended to do. I see it all over this website.

Where I have noticed this the most is that many Scientologists fail to make a distinction between the technology of Scientology, the opinions of Scientology (including Ron's opinions) and the body of supporting information and research (which is not the technology.) Keeping Scientology Working applies to the exact application of the technology -- i.e. the exact processes as laid out in the course packs for training auditors. It does not apply to opinions, research material, supporting materials. It says quite clearly that the exact processes are to be used. Research is not a process, and neither is an opinion so you cannot apply keeping Scientology working to them. There is nothing exact in those materials so how can you insist it be exactly applied? But because this is not understood or misunderstood by many people, this gets interpreted as you musn't read or listen to anything else.

People get all bent out of shape on the subject of we must agree, we must agree, and people are the perpetrators of some amazingly nasty activities in their efforts to get others to agree with them. To add to the confusion, people do join up to socialize, meet women, etc. and they really have very little interest in actual spiritual development or enlightenment.

Having said that, I have noticed that the people who completely fail to make the distinction on what technology actually is and have no idea what they are studying or even why, use whatever belief system and family upbringing they had when they arrived in Scientology. So you can get all kinds of strange responses and behavior, all very opinionated.

I have seen the gamut of human nastiness in the Church, but I have seen EXACTLY the same gamut outside of the Church, on the Internet and in my life in general. This is not peculiar to the Church. For example, Ted Bundy, who killed and raped 30 women, joined the Methodist Church and the Mormon Church to meet women. He said he was a Methodist, he said he was a Mormon, but in reality he was a serial killer looking for women to rape and murder. It is a bit riduculous to blame the Methodists and Mormons for his actions.

What has been disappointing was that I hoped that Scientology would be far more amenable to addressing inhumane, cruel and out-of-ARC behavior. In reality, both public and staff Scientologists with poor understanding of their own materials are very difficult to correct, especially if they have done something wrong and do not want to admit it or have it become public knowledge. I take this as a good sign as they do have remorse and a guilty conscience but it really makes things difficult when you are trying to clean things up.

I appreciate and admire the work that Ron did. Having studied many of the world religions and slogged through tomes and tomes of information to isolate a single useful piece of information, I was very impressed with the amount of work he did to isolate the truths from the sea of information out there. But what I really admire is that he took it a step further, organizing it into a set of exact processes that can be used by anyone. Now that's a first!

I appreciate the work of the staffs and of the senior executives, but I do not and have never 'idolized' or considered myself to be less or 'hat in hand.' I do not grant any rights to them whatsoever to tell me what to do in my life. That is for me to decide. If that causes me to be declared suppressive, denied auditing, or any consequence like that, so be it.

It really pisses me off to see staff members hounded or harmed (especially when they do it to one another and that's usually what is going on) for no good reason. I think it is downright criminal to deny them auditing or training for any reason. If they are working, they deserve to get auditing and training. They are supposed to get 2 and half hours of study/auditing time daily and it really bothers me when they are denied that for any reason. I have three friends who were in the S.O. for over 20 years. They never even got to the point where they could do the clearing course. They had perhaps a cumulative total of 50 hours of actual auditing all told. That's ridiculous and I consider that to be out and out criminal exchange. They, of all people, should have gotten the gains of the very technology they are working so hard to bring to others. I do not know why this is, but it is the single biggest, most glaring outpoint and disastrous state of affairs in Scientology.

In the last few years, staff members have taken to calling me up and telling me that David Miscavage's orders are that every Scientologist is to buy this or that package of books. Constant phone calls, and visits to my home, accusations that I am not on-source, I'm out-ethics and one even threatened to have me declared an suppressive person if I didn't buy the books. I consider this to be completely unacceptable. David Miscavige does not have any right to issue ANY order of ANY kind to me or any public Scientologist. If he really thinks he does then he is 100% squirrel and he should be removed from post, immediately, if not sooner or he should be corrected. He's just a man, and men make mistakes and do stupid things. I doubt that he is an exception to the rule. So get him corrected. He works hard, he's loyal, FIX HIM, don't just try to destroy him. It's insane to destroy something or someone that can and should be fixed. Of course, staff at the lower levels can be awesomely stupid about such things, so I don't even really know if he ever issued such an order. No one ever showed me the order in writing and believe me, I asked. The result of this campaign is that I do not accept phone calls from Church staff members any more or I simply hang up when I find out what they are calling about. I also do not allow them into my home if I have not invited them.

The other ridiculous behavior I have encountered is fear of letting people read information about life, science, the mind, spirituality and religions that are not Scientology materials or that seem to contradict Scientology materials. This is patently absurd and it is a 100% violation of everything thing I have read in Scientology. Again, the confusion is on the difference between the actual technology and exact processes of Scientology and the background, research materials that support it. I'm all for demanding that the exact processes be applied. I am not in agreement with cutting people off from knowledge that might be different or even contrary. As far as opinions go, who cares? Everybody has their own opinion and they have a right to their own opinion. But they don't have a right to enforce their opinion on me or anyone else for that matter. The saddest cut of all is that having such knowledge, even completely wrong knowledge has absolutely no effect on the results to be had from applying the exact processes of Scientology. Right or wrong, good or bad, it's just information. It doesn't DO anything. But auditing does. And what it does when it is properly and skillfully applied is truly, truly wonderful.


5. Why did you choose to stay in the Church of Scientology?
Because I really don't give a damn what anyone says, thinks, believes or does about it or with it. I only care about the results that come from skillful and exact application of the technology. That is what is different, unique and valuable about Scientology.

6. Were you staff or public? If staff, was it at a mission or an org? Were you ever in the Sea Org or OSA? Which unit? If not on staff, did you ever volunteer to 'help out'?
I was on staff for a number of years at a Mission. It was wonderful, it was awful, it was challenging, it was amazing, I loved it, I hated it, and it was a life-changing experience. I worked with really good people and people that were just plain vicious or stupid. People do come in all sizes and shapes.

7. Why did you leave the Church of Scientology? Was there a "final straw"?
I do not go in on course every day. I do not attend events. In my own quiet way I use what I have learned to help people and make things better. When I have sufficient funds, I buy more auditing or training and do it.

8. Do you think the Church of Scientology needs to change some of its practices? If so, what should be changed? How did those practices affect your life?
The Church should stop focusing on trying to make people behave properly, on politics, and on anything that does not 100% back up an effort to get people trained and audited. The staff needs to get their noses out of people's lives and opinions and work on what they are supposed to be working on, which is to offer the best possible training and auditing. The rest is all just bullshit and so much wasted effort.

When I first got into Scientology we were encouraged to train up as auditors and co-audit the first leg of auditing up to the Clearing course. We were told that people who just bought auditing were do-me people, and that they weren't worth spit. Most of the OTs that I now know are do-me people and that early Mission was right - they are do-me people, big on status and most of them are so little trained that they go around handling people the way they learned to in school, in their families and in groups they have belonged to. All the while thinking that they are now an OT. They have only done half of the work of being an OT and they are very, very lopsided people. Big on awareness, but little understanding of how they got there.

As far as ethics and justice goes, people have got to stop thinking of the Church as some kind of law enforcement agency or policing activity and knock off this business of running to the staff with complaints about behavior they don't like. Ron never gave a piss about good or bad behavior unless it interfered with someone's current auditing program. The purpose of ethics is to get the technology applied correctly and to remove elements that would lessen the effectiveness of the auditing WHILE THE PERSON IS GETTING AUDITING. That's all. Beyond that, its a waste of time and money -- if the person gets the auditing they need, the particular activity will eventually fall away anyway. As well, ethics is a personal matter and it is up to the individual to determine what is ethical for them. Anything else is just evaluation and evaluation is the road to hell.

As far as justice goes, the Church is supposed to adhere to the laws of the land. That's official Church policy. I think that Scientologists, like any other citizen of a country, should be be charged with crimes they commit and suffer the consequences that any individual who commits a crime and is found guilty of that crime has imposed on them. For example, if it is really true that David Miscavige has physically assaulted someone, then he should be charged with the crime of assault and battery and damn the torpedoes. It is the only way to root out people who commit crimes from the staffs of the Church. So you get declared. Oh well. You can always petition after the fact to have your status corrected. But be damn sure that you have evidence of the crime, real evidence that will stand up in a court of law. Otherwise there will be no conviction and you'll really be in the soup. Bottom line: I didn't come all this way to have a senior executive of the Church break the law and then act in such a way as to be above the law. That is not okay with me. I am completely astonished that staff who witnessed this did not file charges. If it is true, it is destructive to not file charges or take steps to remove him from post.

I think that senior execs need to get off this 'we're going to run the world' idea that I have heard at events. I do not want ANY Church in charge of government and I specifically do not want the Church of Scientology in charge. I want them to do the job they are supposed to do, which is provide excellent training and auditing. PERIOD. As well, I am 100% behind the constitution of the United States, with its separation of Church and State and I don't care how good that Church is. They need to stay in their own province and domain, the domain of the spirit.


9. If the items you listed in the previous question were changed, would you consider rejoining or staying in the Church of Scientology? If so, why?
I do not consider the Church of Scientology to be a group in the sense of a social group like the Christian Church. For me, it is a service organization that is intended to offer courses and auditing. That's all. There's nothing to join, there are just courses and auditing to buy and do. So this question is completely meaningless to me. The IAS (International Association of Scientologists) is a different matter. To do Scientology services you must have an IAS membership. It is the IAS that does all the publicity capers, pushes on social reform and so on. I am a lifetime member of the IAS but I do not do much in terms the social betterment activities they are currently working on. I consider it to be a waste of time as I think that the only thing that is going to make any change for the better is training people and auditing people. In that order. I think the IAS should set up an endowment fund that offers student loans for people to get trained up as auditors to Class 5. The funds should only be available for that. That would be far more effective than anything they are currently doing.

10. Any additional comments you would like to make?
One of the greatest gains I have had from my Scientology training and auditing has been clarity. I see that it is also what the OTs on this site have gained. I think it is really amusing that the auditing they had gave them more clarity, and of course with more clarity they actually see what is going on. And here they are reporting on what they now see! It's a scream! That's what auditing is supposed to do, so you see, it did work after all.

All you have to do is ensure that people get trained and audited. And when they become more aware, and things are clearer to them, they will automatically notice and try to do something about the outnesses they see. As far as I am concerned, Ron was completely successful in doing what he intended to do, and that is free beings from their own misperceptions and reactivity. But the group of people in Scientology and on staff, the group itself is nowhere near being even remotely clear so you get all kinds of nonsense going on. Control an actual OT? You can't. Oh yes, you can scare them a bit, you can mess with them, but you can NEVER AGAIN PULL THE WOOL OVER THEIR EYES. And guess what? The results are permanent.

Ron always said that the punishment for an organization that wasn't applying the technology correctly or didn't seem to be acting in keeping with the materials of Scientology would find that its course rooms were empty with no auditing occurring. He also said that the only way of fixing it was to get back on track by applying training and auditing exactly.

I am very hopeful that OSA and/or the RTC is monitoring this website. If you are, please get back to what you are supposed be doing. If you will just do that, it will all sort out and you won't have these awful condemnations all over the Internet. DO YOUR JOB. ENSURE THAT THE CHURCHES ARE 100% FOCUSED ON TRAINING AND AUDITING PEOPLE. THAT'S ALL YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO DO.


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